The Game Industry and Marketing

[Siberianhusky89]

Originally Posted by yaustar

It may not be YOUR priority but about the people you work with? Own the studio? You employ? They need to make a living somehow. In fact, how would you make a living while developing your labour of love? How will you get the funding if your number one priority isn't for it to sell more then you borrowed? How do you convince the consumers to buy the game if it is something they have never heard of and/or outside of their comfort zone?

*Sigh* But it seems like people who want to get in the business want in just so they can make money and find an easy way out, but they don't realize that it's never going to be easy and they get in and go through what they don't even give too much about. I want to go into the video game industry because it's something I'm pretty sure I'd enjoy doing while still being able to live my life. Money is still somewhat "important" to me, however, it's really just not as important to me as it is to others. Life's too short to live doing crap you don't want to, just so you can make money. Anyhow, my "labor of love" is something that will be a of high quality, I won't perfect it because I realize that perfect is just a perceptual idea that can probably never be true, I just plan to make it the best I can, and I won't continue to spend funds over and over on very small details just to get it exactly right and such. I am still considerate when it comes to funds and crap, I'm not going to just throw a dollar here and there, I'm still gonna consider options, however, I don't want to have to follow unreasonable crap just because they think it's a good marketing concept.

[yaustar]

*Sigh* But it seems like people who want to get in the business want in just so they can make money and find an easy way out

I disagree. Anyone that has a share in the company obviously want it to make money. Other then that, the games industry doesn't pay well compared to other industries and virtually all that enter it, know this.

Edit: I misunderstood what you said. Yes, you are right. If an investor sees a quick buck or a project that virtually guarantees return, they will take full advantage to make the most of it and quite frankly, if I owned a company, so would I. There has to be some consistent cash flow to keep the company afloat and low risk, known quantity projects/licenses will always be high on the list.

At least then, I have some money to throw at how risk, unknown quantity projects to see how they do.

however, I don't want to have to follow unreasonable crap just because they think it's a good marketing concept.

Then you either have to find a company that looks like it can survive on original games (Introversion, Behemoth) for the foreseeable future or start your own company.

[Gshonk]

Originally Posted by Siberianhusky89

Life's too short to live doing crap you don't want to, just so you can make money. Anyhow, my "labor of love" is something that will be a of high quality, I won't perfect it because I realize that perfect is just a perceptual idea that can probably never be true, I just plan to make it the best I can, and I won't continue to spend funds over and over on very small details just to get it exactly right and such.

You are pretty much describing some of the mantras of Indie development.

[Siberianhusky89]

Originally Posted by yaustar

I disagree. Anyone that has a share in the company obviously want it to make money. Other then that, the games industry doesn't pay well compared to other industries and virtually all that enter it, know this.

Edit: I misunderstood what you said. Yes, you are right. If an investor sees a quick buck, they will take full advantage to make the most of it and quite frankly, if I owned a company, so would I. There has to be some consistent cash flow to keep the company afloat and low risk, known quantity projects/licenses will always be high on the list.

At least then, I have some money to throw at how risk, unknown quantity projects to see how they do.


Then you either have to find a company that looks like it can survive on original games (Introversion, Behemoth) for the foreseeable future or start your own company.

It's alright XD But anyhow, the companies don't realize that by NOT taking a risk we could possibly LOSE money by making such harsh conditions by not letting something into a game. Companies nowadays are not willing to take risks even though video games have been showing popularity in taking risks and adding new things, and that even applies to most companies. A very popular Beer company for example (Rated I believe number 6, probably higher in America and only distributes their beer in around half the country) spends their money on new technology and experiments all the time. Their chances of the product working? 50/50, but they still do it. I'm not saying marketing is a bad thing, but companies seem to forget other aspects of marketing that's important such as the ethical aspects as it or the value factors that may incur. I'm not saying this is true, these are just things that they might ignore because they care too much about the money. Personally, I have other goals I wish to accomplish by creating video games, one that I find sincerely important and that others may find cheesy or probably dumb. If you really want to know (though I kinda doubt it "^^) Private message me XD

[bittman]

Originally Posted by Siberianhusky89

It's alright XD But anyhow, the companies don't realize that by NOT taking a risk we could possibly LOSE money by making such harsh conditions by not letting something into a game. Companies nowadays are not willing to take risks even though video games have been showing popularity in taking risks and adding new things, and that even applies to most companies. A very popular Beer company for example (Rated I believe number 6, probably higher in America and only distributes their beer in around half the country) spends their money on new technology and experiments all the time. Their chances of the product working? 50/50, but they still do it. I'm not saying marketing is a bad thing, but companies seem to forget other aspects of marketing that's important such as the ethical aspects as it or the value factors that may incur. I'm not saying this is true, these are just things that they might ignore because they care too much about the money. Personally, I have other goals I wish to accomplish by creating video games, one that I find sincerely important and that others may find cheesy or probably dumb. If you really want to know (though I kinda doubt it "^^) Private message me XD

Actually I think you'll be unpleasantly surprised by how many Independent Projects (IPs) actually flop, and ultimately destroy a studio. It's nowhere near 50/50, and publishers will rarely back a studio again if they flop so much as once.

Generally it does sound like you should go indie, but I must remind you that the "I want to make a game that I want to play" is actually against what it is to be a game designer.

However, if you continue down this path, I would recommend getting people first, telling them your idea later. That's what I did, and now we're 2 months into developing our indie game (though things are a little slow because it's organised over the internet).

[Siberianhusky89]

Originally Posted by bittman

Actually I think you'll be unpleasantly surprised by how many Independent Projects (IPs) actually flop, and ultimately destroy a studio. It's nowhere near 50/50, and publishers will rarely back a studio again if they flop so much as once.

Generally it does sound like you should go indie, but I must remind you that the "I want to make a game that I want to play" is actually against what it is to be a game designer.

However, if you continue down this path, I would recommend getting people first, telling them your idea later. That's what I did, and now we're 2 months into developing our indie game (though things are a little slow because it's organised over the internet).

The 50/50 thing was about the Beer. I don't expect the exact same rules to apply. Anyhow, an example is this, Silent Hill: Homecoming used a very similar idea to Resident Evil 4's system, that didn't exactly work out so well. Also, I'm just following Shigesato Itoi's Philosophy, making a game that FANS want usually turns out to make a game that's kinda crappy like Street Fighter 4 which gives "fan service" up the ass. It's a game the fans want and they seem to think it was worked out well because all their favorite characters returned and the ones they like are really good and the ones they don't like or nowhere near as good, did it sell well? Yes. But was it anywhere near a great game? HAHAHAHAHAH!

[toyoka]

Games are about entertainment (essentially), not money. But the fact that some games are unique, better in gameplay, story, etc (and thus, produce more revenue) is what differentiates a game like World of Warcraft from say... Archlord. Or Diablo from Titan Quest. Money is just a bonus (a really big one at that, depending). If your game is liked, its a good game. If you're game is not liked it is not a good game. It doesn't matter if characters are imbalanced, or campaigns are too hard (or too easy); If the game sells, and people like it.. its a 'good game' by the player's standards. This may not pose true in a game designer's perspective, but it certainly hits the bong.

[Gshonk]

Originally Posted by Siberianhusky89

But was it anywhere near a great game? HAHAHAHAHAH!

http://www.metacritic.com/games/plat...streetfighter4

Looks pretty close to me.

[Siberianhusky89]

Well, let me ask you guys this.

Would you trust the opinion of someone who's been around quite a few fighting games? Or the opinion of a bunch of people who just like Street Fighter games?

Would you trust the opinion of someone who knows music theory about playing a guitar? Or the opinion of someone who just likes music?

Basically, the biggest Street Fighter fan in the World (And rated the best) even thinks that Street Fighter 4 kind of sucks. The imbalance was obvious and it was quite irritating to go on a thread and ACTUALLY see the people who main a character complain about their own chosen character. I've NEVER in my time of fighting games see people ATTACK their main character stating they suck. In a fighting game, I would normally see "This character is good, you just have to know how to use him." or "He's not bad! You just have to be able to use him very well!" But never have I seen the people who main the person state "THEY MAKE HIM SO FUCKING BAD! He's harder to use than other characters, he has no projectiles, and even if you do pull something off, the end result isn't worth it!" Anyhow, 90% of the people online only play Ryu, Ken, Sagat, Akuma, Zangief, or Balrog. Anyhow, here's what I'm trying to state.

Fan service is a way of having the fans be happy about the product so that they'll buy it almost for sure. By adding everyone's old favorite characters and those familiar faces and moves, people got happy and bought the game. Especially with the 3D graphics that take way less effort than making hand drawn sprites that someone would put their sweat and tears into, and even though they did make 3D images, the polygons suck my balls. They look so misformed and some of the characters look like fags. The story is totally the trashiest thing I've ever read in a storyline of any Fighting game ever and very generic. The balance of the game? Well, I don't know whether the SF team has learned anything about balancing a game, they should have stopped, gone to fucking SNK and say "Hey, can you help us balance our game? We don't know what we're doing."

Did it work? Yes.

SHOULD it have worked? FUCK NO!

[yaustar]

Would you trust the opinion of someone who's been around quite a few fighting games? Or the opinion of a bunch of people who just like Street Fighter games?

Why is one person's opinion more important then another. One person didn't like it and didn't think it was good because it was imbalanced. A whole group of other people did enjoy it despite its flaws. Does this mean that the game is good or bad?

If it is good, why did the one person hate it? If it was bad, why did the group of players enjoy it regardless?

If players are enjoying an unbalanced game, does it matter that it is unbalanced?