Math in programming.

[ShadoFrost]

Originally Posted by yaustar

No. Some modelling software have scripting support to do more advanced stuff but no, you do not need to know how to program to be an artist.

Good.
Yeah I've read that you should have good hold on scripting for what ever software you're using be it Maya or StudioMax.

[DTR]

As for the math...

I am under impression, that solid theoretical foundation is always an advantage.
Look at the games industry 20 years ago. 1988.

Not a ?single? game programmer had to deal with matrices, or write complicated pathfinding algorithms in a three dimensional space. 640 Kilobytes were supposed to be enough for everyone.

Well, based on what we are now having as a standard, I would dare to say, there has been a huge leap in complexity of games and their internal processes.

At the moment, a programmer needs to know X, Y and Z about A B and C topics to get along in daily tasks.

However, in ten or even five years, we might be facing a bunch of new concepts, that surely are not going to be anything less complex than the current ones.
And somobody must actually pioneer these concepts.

Computers evolve, but mathematical thinking and methods remain.

I would appreciate if someone actually experienced one would correct me if Im completely lost here. =P

[ShadoFrost]

Originally Posted by DTR

As for the math...

I am under impression, that solid theoretical foundation is always an advantage.
Look at the games industry 20 years ago. 1988.

Not a ?single? game programmer had to deal with matrices, or write complicated pathfinding algorithms in a three dimensional space. 640 Kilobytes were supposed to be enough for everyone.

Well, based on what we are now having as a standard, I would dare to say, there has been a huge leap in complexity of games and their internal processes.

At the moment, a programmer needs to know X, Y and Z about A B and C topics to get along in daily tasks.

However, in ten or even five years, we might be facing a bunch of new concepts, that surely are not going to be anything less complex than the current ones.
And somobody must actually pioneer these concepts.

Computers evolve, but mathematical thinking and methods remain.

I would appreciate if someone actually experienced one would correct me if Im completely lost here. =P

I am by no means experienced but I could say that sounds just about right

[yaustar]

In general, games have gotten bigger but I don't think they have become that much more complex, just the domains have changed. For example, Elite got round the memory limitation and produced a huge galaxy to explore through procedural generation:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elite_(...al_innovations

[DTR]

Originally Posted by yaustar

In general, games have gotten bigger but I don't think they have become that much more complex, just the domains have changed. For example, Elite got round the memory limitation and produced a huge galaxy to explore through procedural generation:

If I understood correctly, they did pretty much the same thing with their Galaxies as devs did with Daggerfalls world geometry. (It too happened to have a huge seamless areas to roam).

I have not actually played elite, but if the procedural generation was a workaround for a memory issue, how on earth could they preserve the consistency of the world even for a single session?

Wouldn't the galaxies and planets be altering their locations and appearances constantly as they were being generated and "released" depending on players location?

Edit: Only thing I could come up with would involve an algorithm that would produce one exact output for one exact seed. Then they would choose and store the seed in the beginning of a new game. Savegame would contain this seed and the gameplay variables.

In order to create any part of the galaxy, you would have to to run the algorithm with the current seed over a range of values representing the desired locale of the galaxy(if the galaxy was generated from left to right, "up" to "down") Output would be the same every time.

In theory, that is.

[yaustar]

Originally Posted by DTR

I have not actually played elite, but if the procedural generation was a workaround for a memory issue, how on earth could they preserve the consistency of the world even for a single session?

Predictable random number generation as mentioned in the link I provided.

[Claxon]

That's one of the reasons I love Elite so much, the scale of the universe, and yet it fits on a floppy. Predictable random sequences (a very simple concept really - just keep the random Seed the same) are the pinnacle of game programming concepts. Simple implementation, low memory footprint, and capable of determining an incredible amount of data. I've use it a few times in my own games, but I've barely scratched the surface compared to what the Elite series did.

[DTR]

Shame really, that the modern games are not offering us those "over the top" world like Daggerfall, Elite. And when they attempt to, (Boiling point: Road To Hell), they are scolded for being buggy.

[Adrir]

Originally Posted by DTR

Shame really, that the modern games are not offering us those "over the top" world like Daggerfall, Elite. And when they attempt to, (Boiling point: Road To Hell), they are scolded for being buggy.

Developing good content within specific team and time constraints is the main barrier at the moment.